Loot cave and Queen armor dismantling for materials nerfed

Source. http://www.bungie.net/7_Hot-Fix---09252014/en/News/News?aid=12190

additional

http://www.bungie.net/7_Destiny-Dev-Notes/en/News/News?aid=12188

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Hot Fix - 09/25/2014

by Destiny Dev Team Sep 25 at ‎2‎:‎42‎:‎36‎ ‎PM

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Summary

In Hotfix 5, we made a few changes to reduce the effectiveness of a humbling number of economy exploits. Check out these Destiny Dev Notes to read a summary of our impressions since launch. 

 

Activities

 

Missions

• Reduced drop rate of engrams following a hard wipe [fixed in 1.0.1.4]

 

Queen's Wrath Event

• Material rewards for dismantling Queen's Wrath gear will no longer provide ascendant materials, but missions will continue to drop Legendary items

 

World

 

Destinations

• The Hive of the holy “Treasure Cave” have realized the futility of their endless assault on Skywatch and have retired to lick their wounds and plan their next attack.
• Respawn timers for monster caves in Skywatch have been normalized to 40 seconds (increased from 6)
• Respawn timers for monster caves in Forgotten Shore have been normalized to 40 seconds (increased from 10)
• Respawn timers for monster caves in Ember Caves have been normalized to 40 seconds (increased from 10)
• Respawn timers for monster caves in the Shattered Coast have been normalized to 40 seconds (increased from 10)
• Respawn timers for monster caves in the Barrens have been normalized to 40 seconds (increased from 20)

Quote:

Destiny Dev Notes

by Destiny Dev Team Sep 25 at ‎1‎:‎40‎:‎35‎ ‎AM

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On September 9th the Bungie team traded late nights building Destiny for late nights playing Destiny with all of you. We'd looked forward to that day for years, knowing that it would bring millions of fresh eyes into our world and quickly change many of our plans and priorities. We were not disappointed.

 

In the last two weeks there have been many surprises, bugs, exploits, world firsts, and a whole lot of fun. It's been an amazing time. We think now is a great time to step back and let you all know how we think the game is holding up and to talk about some changes we are contemplating going forward.

 

We will be patching some of these issues as early as today. Others may not be addressed for a month or two. Stay tuned for updates and thank you for all your feedback online.

 

Loot

 

He Who Shall Not Be Named

Long ago during development, the Cryptarch decoded engrams of a given color into gear of that same color. Early in 2014 we added randomness, both for better and worse, to the decrypting process. The result was that end-of-session engram decoding got a lot more exciting and the Cryptarch himself suddenly acquired a personality. Both of these experiences were positive additions to the game.

 

But we didn't adequately communicate the potential random outcomes of decryption. Players see what looks like the familiar metaphor of item identification, while the Cryptarch thinks he's opening a grab bag of loot. Rage sharding of blues ensues. Expect to see changes to address this soon.

 

Destiny: The Cave

The social experience of a cave farming run is amazing: the herding to get a team of Guardians all behind the line and firing in the right direction, the rush to grab the loot, the scramble when the panic wave starts, the beckoning glow from inside the cave. The speed at which the community organized around this activity was inspiring and humbling to us.

 

But shooting at a black hole for hours on end isn't our dream for how Destiny is played. Our hope is that social engagement in public spaces is only one part of the Destiny experience. Expect changes soon which decrease the efficiency of cave farming and correspondingly increase engram drops from completing activities.

 

Reward Celebration

Growing more powerful by acquiring new upgrades, gear or progression is central to Destiny's player experience. Our goal is to always celebrate when this occurs, both as a reward in and of itself and to communicate to players what is going on.

 

During development we sometimes prioritized making a system functional over celebrating its rewards, for example:

• The Vault of Glass contains highly coveted loot but the actual moment of reward happens without fanfare and can be easily missed.
• The lowest level of the Daily Heroic gives great XP and Reputation rewards, but neither of these progressions appears on the postgame screen.
   

We will slowly be addressing these and other issues going forward.

 

Social

 

Voice Communication

Our vision for Destiny is that all players, even matchmade players in the Crucible, Strikes, the Tower or public spaces, be able to communicate with one another in a way that promotes positive socialization. Voice communication is the easy answer, but existing voice paradigms, including those in our own Halo games, have not done enough to protect players from abusive griefing from a minority of players.

 

Destiny's near-term solution will be to allow players to opt-in to voice communication during matchmade activities. Work on this feature was underway at launch and should be rolled out this year in Strikes and the Crucible.

 

Activities

 

Strikes

Strikes are intended to be a fun, combat-filled romp and stomp with a big boss and cool rewards at the end. Better with cooperation, but doable in a pick up group.

 

Since launch we've tracked down an issue which has made Strikes more challenging than originally designed by both increasing damage taken by players and decreasing the damage inflicted by players on the boss. Expect to see this addressed soon, and for Strikes to become a little less grindy as a result (sorry, Raiders - incoming damage is working as intended in the Vault of Glass). 

 

Balance

 

Our goal when balancing Destiny is to never have one player choice-- for example a choice of class or weapon-- either be so much better than the alternatives that it is the only valid choice or to be so much worse that it would always be a mistake to choose. When we are successful with this kind of balance the result is a wide set of equally compelling player builds, some of which may be preferred by one player or another but none of which is an absolute right or wrong choice.

 

Exotic Weapons

Exotic Weapons are designed to look, feel and sound overpowered, but to not actually break the game. We hope these weapons challenge the way players think about their loadouts and expect their idiosyncrasies to sometimes be a little frustrating. We find ourselves wanting to collect them all and hope players feel the same way.

 

Not all our Exotic Weapons currently live up to this promise. In particular those weapons received from completing exotic bounties including Thorn and Bad Juju have disappointed many of us who have gone through the great effort to obtain them because, despite looking and sounding amazing, they feel underpowered. We're here to offer some advice: don't shard those guns. Their time will come.

 

Auto Rifles

The Auto Rifle archetype is designed to appeal to players who like to throw up a wall of bullets and not worry if a few miss their target. It is intended to inflict sustained damage at close to medium range, but to lose effectiveness at longer ranges.

 

Today the Auto Rifle is too effective at long range, even beating Scout and Pulse Rifles in some circumstances. Expect stability and/or damage adjustments to the Auto Rifle to address this in the weeks ahead. 

 

Scout Rifles

Scout Rifles are for players who like to keep their enemies at medium range and hate to miss. They are intended to be an awkward weapon to use at close range but to be dominant-- as long as you land your shots-- at medium and longer ranges.

 

Scouts just aren't hitting hard enough today when compared to other precision weapons. We'll be addressing this soon.

 

Shotguns

Shotguns are for those situations where you need to deliver a massive spike of damage, right now, to the thing standing next to you about to do you harm. 

 

Today shotguns are effective beyond their intended range, especially when upgraded with that intention. Expect changes soon to address shotguns which push the envelope of what it means to be close quarters.

 

 

Thank you for helping us drive these changes. Keep sharing. Keep talking. We’re watching and listening.

weapons sound like well thought changes.

The cave is probably a good thing I did it for awhile for the first time last night.  It was ridiculous 8 level 20 plus people pumping rounds into a hole, and you get experience just being their I noticed after running out of ammo.  I got a legendary rocket lancher and a bunch of blue items.....and I felt dirty afterward.
 

So what's the point of the Queen's missions now.  I already have legendary gear and upgrades as far as I can go.  I need shards and they're too damn hard to come by.

Definitely pissed about the Queen's nerf.

It also sucks that nerfing the loot cave also nerfs engram drops throughout the entire game.

I'm not sure how to take this since it is becoming harder to want to play this game when everything is so repetitive and they have just made it harder to receive rewards for doing it. Sure they will "fix" the Cryptarch some day but for now you just have to deal with less reward for the same amount of work...

Sad really.

"But shooting at a black hole for hours on end isn't our dream for how Destiny is played."

Apparently their dream is for people to play the game once a week to do the one nightfall strike and one raid then put it away for the next 6 days. Doing 40+ strikes and not even getting a single purple engram is beyond stupid and just makes it boring, but that's how it works. At least with the loot cave you get to kill that same number of enemies in an hour or two so at least then when you get nothing you didn't waste 2 or 3 days.

And now what's the point of the queens missions? I got the helmet, I don't need 4 more of them. Her weapons suck, so there's no point to her bounties at all.

It's a very good thing Destiny didn't launch in November with the big boys, don't think too many people would be hanging on to it.

As much as I liked the game when it first dropped...it's getting harder for me to want to keep playing. Let's play the same 10 missions over and over....with no promise of any actual good loot that will get me to a higher level.

Bungie - "hey...let's be a social game with social this and social that, with no trading or sharing items between friends. Let's cap your XP level at 20 and make you get light focussed armor to get to a higher level, and then go find materials to make that armor better, but make you grind through 10+ missions over and over with no promise of getting any of these materials. Let's also have 10 different kinds of currency and ranks for every thing."

The Cryptarch thing is 100% bullshit. Why color code the engrams if the cryptarch isn't gonna give you a color matched item. Purple does not equel 3 greens. I got a legendary drop. i want a goddamn legendary item. Though they did address this in their last update post so hopefully they will take out the random color crap.

Crucible - Doesn't seem to matter how well you do. I scored 2nd place and did pretty damn well in 1 match. Didn't get anything. People below me got stuff. Dafuq? Why play if I'm not gonna get anything out of it. I don't like playing with randoms. Given the choice I'd play with friends only. So if I'm forced to play with randoms....give me a reason to come back other than doing more things I don't like for some bullshit rank and marks for items I will probably never buy.

I like Bungie. But they f*cking up right now.

The nerf on dismantling the Queen's gear is way more drastic than ending the loot cave.  Never got why people would stand there for hours, I'd rather grind out patrols and bounties then shot at a cave.  Well either that or some of the runs (the Mars relic iron run in particular).

FYI, Ishtar University and adjoing areas are very good farming areas for 'real men'. Lots of Fallen and Vex but you actually have to move and aim and select Elemental weapons. Sometimes these areas literally surge with enemies.

I agree there are some problems with the game - most specifically the "reward moment" and how little variety there is in the weapons.  The variety in missions is a little stale, but they still incentivise you to play them far more than say Firefight in any other Halo game.  This part doesnt bother me that much.  Fixing voice comms is literally the single most important thing they can do, IMHO.  Not being able to socialize in a social game kills a large part of its allure.  

But nefing the loot cave and its ilk was absolutely correct.  They were clearly broken.   Personally I cant believe anyone would choose to do that over literally anything else - no matter what loot it gave.  To each his own I guess.

The queens mission loot sharding thing is perhaps a bit much - perhaps just reduce the chance to get those particular materials...  The weapons changes are needed.  Its still AR or go home.  I love them, but there really is no reason to use anything else. Nerfing sniper shotguns is welcome.

Right now, crucible loot is 100% random.  Ive gotten 3 legendary crucible drops and 2 of thre were in games that were probabaly my worst MP games in any game ever.  I belive they need to change it so one column is performance based, and one column is random.  So, top 3 or 4 will always get something, and all slots will also have a random chance for loot in the second column.

Actually, many of those changes sound like great improvements to the game. I'll gladly give up loot caves for a greater desire to play Strikes for example.

The Queen's mission shards nerf sucks. I don't fucking need 7 Queen's robes. The only thing they were good for was shards. I'm not going to change my gear to something that's going to lower my light level AND make me use shards to upgrade it. 

Unfortunately I still have 2 of the 4 coats I received. Now no shards. What do you get when you dismantle them?

Weapon balancing sounds perfect for pvp, and I too am dismayed by the shardless queen gear and engram nerfs.

Oh well, I am still finding it difficult to do all the weekly/daily stuff as it is, so I have no major complaints at this point.  Just need to find 5 people to do the VoG with now that I'm leve 26. :P

yeah that's kind of an odd choice for them as well with the whole matchmaking versus finding friends. If you do strikes....they put you with randoms. If you do a raid....you have to have friends. no matchmaking.

I do like some of the improvements you guys listed.

Stopping the loot cave actually does nothing.  There's already another 'loot cave' going around, and rumors of plenty more.  The loot caves are bringing my wife and I back into playing the game just for the thrill of looting it until the cops shut it down....then we'll just move on to the next one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wfxf7V_cljA&feature=youtu.be

My wife and I looted that spot last night.  Not quite as nice as the Loot Cave because of the slightly longer respawn time (10 seconds?), and really requires 2 people to do smoothly, but we still did better in 30 minutes there than we did for the other 2 hours we played strikes, missions, and patrols last night.

I wonder if a Loot Cave game would sell?

Skip all the development and that big game in the middle. Just make a monster cave and a gun to shoot at the escapees. Don't even spend time on monster graphics as they rarely leave the cave anyway. Players just need shoot in straight lines and then announce what they got.

I wonder if a bullet sponge game would sell?

Do away with the need for any sort of intelligence or teamwork or any silly stuff like that, just have a giant yellow sponge stand still and make you hold down RT for 10 minutes til it falls over. It could even drop hats that aren't as good as the ones you already have.

Apparently it already does. $250,000,000 worth already sold.

Nice.

I'm always a little surprised when people complain about exploits getting shut down.  After months and months of of GTA Online you would think I'd be used to it.

I don't care how you play the game, but here's a tip...

If you saw the exploit on Youtube, it's going to get shut down soon.

If you want shortcuts to levelling and loot, go out, find them and then don't broadcast them.  I promise you that a game this big still has many areas available to let you avoid what you consider pointless grinding and that I consider the game.

As for the economy being complicated, my only experience with anything of this scale was a true MMO, but a very early one.  Ultima Online was much more complicated by a good big factor and I think the reason behind that choice was to provide for a variety of playing experiences within a single game.  My understanding with the newer MMO's is that it has gotten even more complicated.  For me, Destiny hits that sweet spot.  I don't want to read a book to learn how to play your game, but I don't mind spinning my gears for a while, making some poor decisions and learning from them. If that's intolerable to you, this probably isn't the game for you.  I don't think the multiple currencies are a design flaw that Bungie didn't detect until they released the game.  I think they're a planned mechanic.

Another valuable lesson I have learned is that if you are unhappy with the game, you still are probably not going to get your money back.  No matter how much you piss and moan in here.  It might be best to just stop playing and cut your losses.  

Also, stop whining.  It's really unattractive.