My 6.5 Grendel and why I love it.

cmoth

Shared on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 07:13

It was inevitable really. Sooner or later I have to right something about firearms.

For those of you who don't "get it" firearms as a hobby is the same as any other hobby, an interest taken to the next level. Just like cars, toys, baseball cards, or whatever else you can think of, firearms are just another inanimate object that have been given a value and personal status with specific people for varying reasons. I'm no militant, I'm not necessarily a "prepper" (technically) but I'm no gun snob either. I am about to use some terminology that will leave those of you with no interest in firearms in the dust, although I'll try to keep it as simple as possible. Don't say I didn't warn you.

Because I'm a police officer by profession my taste in firearms tends to gravitate around law enforcement / patrol use weapon varieties. I like pistols, semi-automatic rifles and 12 gauge pump and semi-auto shotguns. As my profile indicates, I'm also a weapons instructor and armorer with factory certifications from Remington, Glock and Armalite. Because of my armorer responsibilities I keep my skills sharp by working on and generally tinkering with firearms of the type I would use at work.

As far as I'm concerned only ugly, utilitarian, semi-auto, magazine fed weapons are interesting. My father, was puzzled.

The primary way in which my hobby manifests is I build on a regular basis Ar15 rifles for myself and others. The nice thing about the Ar15 platform is it's modularity and ease of obtaining parts. After obtaining a lower receiver (either completed or stripped) through a licensed dealer, all other parts and accessories can be delivered directly to you by the service of your choosing.

This, by the way, is a very good thing. Regardless of how you may personally feel about private ownership of firearms, you might get the hint from my previous blogs that I have my own opinion on the matter and it is set in granite.

My latest rifle build was in a fairly new cartridge, the 6.5 x 38 mm, also known as the 6.5 Grendel or .264 LBC depending on your loyalties. I prefer to think of it as the Grendel since it was originally called that by it's co-developer, Bill Alexander of Alexander Arms. Co-developed because while he originally came up with the concept he eventually discovered that the Russians were already on the right track of what he wanted, a superior cartridge to the 5.56mm Nato capable of being fed through an Ar15 platform with limited modification to the firearm (ie: changes to the barrel, bolt and magazine). You can find more on this through Wikipedia if you are interested. But, long story short it goes like this: 7.62x39mm (Ak47 round) to .220 Russian to 6.5 Grendel (with some other ideas thrown in for spice). It was primarily a compromise decision for ease of manufacture but the results are stunning.

The 6.5mm bullet has been around for a very long time. It has persisted because it has an extremely good ballistic coefficient (how efficient the round goes through the air basically). Bench-rest / long-range competitors keep going back to it (including the 6.5 Creedmore, a necked down .308 case).

In the 6.5 Grendel you get a more efficient and heavier bullet that travels flatter and farther than the 5.56mm round that also delivers much better terminal ballistics and accuracy. While it has a much lower velocity when it initially leaves the barrel (about 2400 feet per second plus or minus depending on bullet weigh versus near 3000 fps for the 5.56mm) it is actually going faster out at about 1000 meters (slower than it's muzzle velocity but it looses much less velocity due to drag than the 5.56mm which has slowed down to sub-sonic velocity at that range).

Considering that the standard .308 / 7.62 Nato cartridge is a 150 grain bullet traveling at about 2800 fps at the muzzle (roughly 2600 ft lbs of energy) and the Grendel is optimized for the 120 grn bullet at around 2700 fps generating just shy of 2000 ft lbs of energy you can see why it's considered a capable intermediate cartridge. All that with far less recoil than the 7.62x51mm with better accuracy and higher velocity maintained at greater ranges.

While most compare the 6.5 Grendel to the 5.56mm Nato load I find this horribly unfair to the little .22 round that McNamara birthed. I think the 6.5 measures up very favorably against the .308. Yes the .308 definitely has more power but the 6.5 gives good power, better penetration against barrier and does it with better average accuracy and more rounds carried in fewer magazines for the same load-out. And it can be used in the much lighter Ar15 / M16 that everybody knows and loves (or at least grudgingly tolerates).

It's at this point I start fantasizing about a M249 type weapon with a 150 round linked belt of Grendel....

...I just wooded.

My rifle is a bit of a mutt. I built it using primarily Alexander Arms primary components )barrel, bolt, upper receiver, stripped lower receiver). I filled in the empty spaces with small parts from DPMS and BravoCompany (I love those guys). Of course, all of my furniture and a few add-ons are all MagPul. I topped it off with a Leupold Vari-XIII that I got from my dad (bought originally in 1967, three years older than me).

Bear in mind that I am a mediocre rifle shot at best, my skill weapon is a handgun. But, even with me handicapping the rifle I'm still averaging just under 1" groups at the 100 yard mark. With a better rifleman behind it that group shrinks (BtW, I'm getting these groups with the cheaper Wold Gold 120 grn Multi-Purpose, the Hornady 123 grm A-Max does much better).

I'd post a picture or two but I don't host photos anywhere, (too lazy). When I get around to doing that perhaps I'll put up some pics.

 

Happy shooting.

Comments

cmoth's picture
Submitted by cmoth on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 07:19

I forgot to mention, my rifle is a 16" carbine, not a full length rifle with a heavy barrel. It weighs the same as the Ar15 in 5.56mm that I carry on duty.

 

H2Daddy's picture
Submitted by H2Daddy on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 11:24

Would love to see some pics some time. I am currently torn about a new gunpurchase myself. I have saved up to build an ar but was recently presented a pretty good deal on a Glock. I already own a Glock 22 but for whatever reason, I shoot it poorly. I have always wanted to try some IDPA or USPSA shooting at a local club. Talking to one of the other dads on my son's baseball team, turns out his dad shoots regularly there and recently won a Glock 17 gen 4. My Glock is a gen 3 and has run flawlessly. I am reading a lot of complaints about the gen 4 and ejection issues. Just wondering what your feelings are on the gen 4s?  Part of me wants to build an ar that I have always wanted but don't need or spend a lot less and get the Glock and try out some of the shooting competitions. The Glock is new in box with all goodies for $450. (I know that isn't a great deal for officers but for us civilians, it's a pretty good deal) By the time I build the ar and put the optics on it that I want AND by ammo. I will have spent a little more than I should. The Glock keeps me well under budget but probably wont be near as fun. Decisions, decisions.

Leviticus78's picture
Submitted by Leviticus78 on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 11:55

Go for the AR, H2.

It opens up a whole new world of options and configurations that just aren't available for a lot of guns. I got mine through a "build staircase for gun" trade and I'm loving it. I've only smoothed the burs for the trigger because it had a HORRIBLY rough trigger pull and added a Magpul 30 round clip.

Once I get the $700 bucks in accessories I want to add you probably won't see me gaming for awhile as I'll be spending my weekends varmint hunting smiley.

H2Daddy's picture
Submitted by H2Daddy on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 12:18
Lol, the gun is the cheap part. It's all the accessories, optics and ammo that is going to cost. I actually just but a S&W MP 15-22 for cheap shooting. I have looked at putting an Eotech on it but then the optics would cost more than the gun.
Leviticus78's picture
Submitted by Leviticus78 on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 12:24

I don't know about your Glock but the ammo for my AR is cheaper than the ammo for my 40 S&W Steyr. I can get 200 rounds of .223 for $80 through Sportsmans.

I don't know the pricing on the variants that Cmoth has mentioned.

cmoth's picture
Submitted by cmoth on Wed, 07/04/2012 - 16:46

Unfortunately, Grendel ammo isn't cheap but it is effective. Wolf Gold can be bought in bulk but it's price is favorable to a .308 (box of 20 in Wolf is about $14, a box of 20 in the Hornady A-Max is about $20). But, the Grendel isn't a plinker, I treat it like I do some of my bolt guns.

My 5.56mm Ar is for duty use and it's only used for patrol, call-outs and training. As a result, my ammo for that is department provided. Which means free but budgeted. So at first your like, "Whee" and then your like, "Aww".

I'll try to firgure out a way to post pics of the Grendel.

Leviticus78's picture
Submitted by Leviticus78 on Mon, 06/25/2012 - 11:48

You are far more involved in to gunsmithing than I am, lol. 

Your comments about AR15 parts has peaked my interest though as I have recently acquired one and am currently putting together a list of mods to bring it out of it's stock A2 look.

Perhaps I could ask you for some pointers about brand names and such?

cmoth's picture
Submitted by cmoth on Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:43

Hmm, thought I updated this earlier... oh well.

Update:

Since posting this article I've made a change that I feel very comfortable recommending to others now that I've tried it. Since shooting the Grendel on the Ar platform i've noticed one huge thing. The bolt / carrier assembly is absolutely ROCKETING back under recoil. Not to say that recoil is "harsh" or anything. But, it is more abrupt which can screw up your concentration for follow up shots. Also, I kept thinking, "Aw damnit, there's some excessive wear and tear on my internals I don't need".

To remedy this I've purchased one possible change that has been recommeded to me before. When people loaded up hotter loads for the 5.56 / .223 rifles to get better performance or have changed calibers they've had the same downside. It's coincidently the same downside the military experienced when they went from the rifle version of the M16 to the carbine version during the Vietnam era. The shorter gas tube was increasing pressure, increasing cyclic rate and decreasing reliable function. The military folks figured out quickly that the faster bolt speed is caused by the higher pressure working the action faster than the weighted buffer and buffer spring werre designed to handle. This can also lead to other issues as well which effect reliability.

To slow down the carrier assembly you can make the assembly itself heavier but that can get ... tricky. The easiest thing to do, and is done on a regular basis, is to either get a heavier buffer (an H3 being the most common) or a "heavier" buffer spring. I chose the latter and bought an extra power buffer spring from Wolff Gunsprings. In order for it to work in a carbine length stock tube I had to cut one and a half coils off the "bottom" end. Bottom means the section against the back end of you tube NOT the buffer end. You'd hate screwing that up or re-installing it correctly after cutting. Also, it's good idea to not have a buffer tube with a drainage hole at the back end. It would suck to have the exposed end of a spring shooting into your face under recoil pressure. 

Anywho, I cut mine to fit and took it out for a function test. Other than one failure to feed (looks like another half coil is coming off) it functioned flawlessly and also made a significant difference. It now softly bumps instead of the high speed hickup. It's now an easier gun to shoot and as a result it's quicker and I'm more accurate with it.

Cheers everybody, happy shooting.

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