A sad day for 2old2play

shit happens and tough decisions have to made. i know exactly where Cotton's comment is coming from, but people are human on both sides of this situation. people make decisions and have to live them. its never easy and often gray. generation kill: "don't pet a burning dog"

This whole thing seems a bit knee-jerky and childish. Everyone at 2o2p put a lot of effort into the site... and everyone at 2o4D, of which i'm a proud member, put a lot of work into the clan. Why not just work it out like adults? The 2o4D site has been around for a while. We used it in conjunction with the 2o2p forums. That said, we have no control over the 2o2p site and it's your baby and the fruit of your labor... you deserve the right to act at whatever level of maturity you see fit... I really like 2old2play.com and have met a lot of cool, like-minded gamers on here. I really like 2old4duty and have met a lot of cool, like-minded gamers there. None of this will change any of that.

Aww, AMC, touch a nerve, did I? It's a valid statement. The people harassing Doodi and DSmooth for doing what's right to protect their brand are asshats. That goes for more than just 2o4d people. Unless those people crying foul are admins with their own Intellectual Property (as 2o2p is a brand, even if they don't market it as such) have had a similar issue with a possible copyright infringement, or have dealt with the possibly far reaching consequences of ignoring such possible infringements, then really those people are just spouting off drivel based on a fairytale world of niceness that doesn't actually exist. Just because we (the members of 2o2p, all of us, including those in 2o4d) come here to game and get away from the bullshit that drives up our blood pressure in our personal lives, doesn't mean that there aren't people out there that view communities like 2o2p as a potential source of marketing revenue. The more exposure a site like 2o2p gets, the more someone would love to hijack it and sell it, which could leave us out in the cold. Don't believe me? It happens a lot to Warcraft communities. So if I feel the need to call a group of jackasses (not only those 2o4d people, but others as well talking out of their asses about how 'this whole thing has been handled wrong') then I'll call'em jackasses. There are no "facts" to come clean. Whoever made the mock-up tacked on a copyright symbol to brand formula in adult gaming used at 2o2p. That's an issue, a potentially serious one. Doodi and Smooth were nice, as I'd have simply locked the 2o4d forum, posted why it was locked in a locked site announcement. Then contacted whoever was responsible and asked WTF. If I didn't like the answer or felt it wasn't an innocent 'oops'-moment, I'd be threatening a lawsuit. But you see, Doodi and Smooth are actually nice guys. It's not personal. They may be personally affected and feel betrayed, but so far they're actually being quite nice about it. -Plato

I'm a 2o4D member and this is news to me. I enjoy 2old2play, and I enjoy the 2o4D guys I play with. I'm all about kickin' back and havin' fun online. That's all for me. :)

This is all news to me but seriously how childish! 2o4D have a separate site.. so what? Is that against the site rules? Is it inconceivable that they needed to be able to handle more stuff than they were able or allowed to do here? So they copyrighted the name, again big whoop di do, I helped come up with the name and it doesnt bother me one bit. Do 2O2P believe that they own every clan name that is created on this site? Seriously what is your problem with that? Why so offended over a clan copyrighting the name that they have chosen? And as for setting up in competition, how insecure are you feeling? Even if it were true do you really think that a COD focused clan is that much of a threat? Come off it the 2O2P membership is huge covering a wide range of games so why get all neurotic??? I have been a member of 2o4D pretty much since I joined 2O2P and couldn’t wish to have found a nicer group of people, they have been there with support and advice when ever I or fellow clan mates have needed it most and you want to take that all away in a fit of childish pique, Shame on you! I have been proud to be a member of 2o2p , I have promoted it whenever I can on various forums across the internet, not just recommending 2o4D but 2o2P as a whole. But this is an example of the sort of petulant immature behavior that I thought I had left behind when I signed on here. If you have an issue with the individual then deal with the individual, taking down the whole clan is just petty beyond belief I will continue my search for a MATURE Gamers site because this sure as shizzle aint it! Caput Mortis signing off 2o4TS

I knew the 2old4duty.com site existed. Didn't it start as a place to sell 2o4d merch?

Looks like things are settling down already. Shoot me if I'm wrong. The new break away site name issue is getting resolved. 2old4duty members are becoming informed and making decisions. No need for anyone to make knee-jerk reactions over this now. Harsh words will only break fences that will need mending down the road. I'd like to read calmer words on this whole issue from 2old2play Admin a month from now. No really, take a month before commenting further. Long life to 2old2play.com and may it be continually renewed. Kudos to the admin/creators. Success to the break away site. You were going to go sometime anyway. Do all that you can to maintain good relations with this site. You'll feel good about yourselves for doing it.

Could you guys have let everyone enjoy reminiscing about the LAN? Had to try and overshadow the wonderful drunkenness and charity work to get your drama fix? Didn't Taxi throw a fucking shoe or something? I sat at home, unable to make it to the fucking LAN and hating it, ready to enjoy the great stories that come from it, but you guys gotta shit on it for me. Don't you retards realize that you are here for MY pleasure? I'm driving somewhere and punching somebody, I shit you not. Motherfuckers. Daddy still not happy.

holy shit. Sometimes I'm glad I'm not part of a clan, this seems like a big deal :-) but, given I've been around a bit and work with one of the admins I can tell you this site wasn't born of splintering from another gamer site. Just the first five people or so, but five people don't make a site. We grew to roughly 30 people, then 90, then 100 and were proud to have 100 active gamers. Then after some exposure in OXM it grew passed 2,000 and more. Really, it wasn't a splinter as much as exposure in a magazine that had a big audience.

I'm forming my own site. 2old4BS.com. We have cookies. Seriously, I don't see it as childish. "People" put a lot of time and effort into this site and that results in a legit feeling of ownership. I think they have a right to give a damn if someone decides to run off with "2old-anything" and try and make it their own. If you want to start your own gaming site, fine. But show some originality and quit trying to blame doodi and others for what is happening.

I don't know what all happened at the primarch, root, decision makers, admins, etc level - and frankly, don't care. Drama's not my thing. I have no 'allegience' to anything other than what's real in life. That said, I do not believe a public forum should be shut down. The forum is as much part of the hobby to some folks as the gaming is. I can appreciate that. I understand the emotion, but that's what can define a good leader folks, don't let the emotion cloud your mind, continue to make good decisions. Locking the forum seems a bit knee jerk if the majority of the members are not responsible for whatever issue took place. Perhaps 2o2p Admin's need to ban some members, lock perpitrator accounts, appoint a new admin to the forum in question via poll or something, but locking down a forum is censorship. Freedom of speech in their clan forum should not be taken away unless you wish to punish the clan as a whole. That's the message that will be sent. It's like kicking the kids to the curb while parents fight inside... the kids, it seems by your own admission, didn't do anything wrong here unless I'm misunderstanding. If possible, it would be better for the parents to excuse themsleves and discuss like adults in private like civilized human beings while the kids continue to play in the home they are familiar with and love. Just my take, Tac

DSmooth, You guys need to let this go. You said that they had copyrighted the name but then it turns out that your proof is a copyright symbol on a youtube video which means absolutely nothing. There are far too much half-truths out there now and this is a perfect example. Time to move on and enjoy life and gamming guys...

Just rename the clan "2old4Doodi" and move on, eh?

This is pretty lame. I joined this site a few months back after hearing about it on LIVE, and think its great. Then I joined 2o4D like 2 weeks ago cuz they seemed cool and played CoD as their primary game. Then I log on after the weekend and find this? I came to this site, and this clan so I would no longer have to deal with this petty, drama-filled, childish garbage anymore. Guess I'll have to keep looking.

a copyright i think i just died a little inside.

and worst of all, which has already been mentioned. NO LAN PHOTOS!!!! I wanted to see a photo of JeepChick mauling Peepshow! or ATC tearing an xbox controller apart with his elbows... but NOOOOOOO... I get to look at this instead.

My apologies to the 2old4 BS clan. Yeah, copyright. Classy.

It seems to me you guys should have checked in with Stang and confronted him with your questions first, behind closed doors. If you had done that, you could have decided if the answers made sense to you and if not... you could have done something drastic like shut down our forum. Instead, you went for the public flogging and drama right from the get-go. 90% of my 2o2p website time was spent on the 2o4d forum you just shut down. That was where I spent all my time (and saw all your paid advertisements). I have been a member of 2o2p for a long time, and pretty much game exclusively with 2o2p and the clan 2o4d... I have seen a few 2o2p-related head scratchers over the years and this is the biggest one. Since you decided to go public... that now really lowers the chances of a logical solution. It is tough for anyone (even adults apparently) to admit they are wrong once their pride is on line for all to see.

D, I think you have given me all the answers I needed. If you did not know about any of this until after the LAN and made that quick of a decision without waiting for word or info from higher ups in the clan, I do not think anyone would argue that that is absolutely horrific administration. Secondly, if you are basing your decision on info you got from youtube, SHAME ON YOU! This is starting to sound more and more like a drama monster spinning wildly out of control.

@NorthernPlato :you keep trying to come across as a very wise man,but you fall short by the name calling,which i and i'm sure about 200 other people don't appriciate.make all the anti-2o4D comment's you wish,but keep the little boy name calling in your house cause we don't wantta hear it.

as i remember it,it was started for ladder tourney's. it would have been nice to get some type of warning before our clan was disolved here,i only found out thru messenger....

Wow. Real life steps in the way and I find a train wreck. It just sounds to me like lack of communication turned into a disaster. To those that say good riddence- I'm at a loss for words. There were a small select few that even knew anything about this and to group all of 2o4d into that blame is a slap in the face to those that adore this site as much as you. I, personally, am completely torn by this. I joined this site as 2o2p, have been in a few clans and 2o4d happens to be one of them. There are some great people in that clan. The thing this pisses me off the most are those that throw those that had an agenda(or did they- I have no idea) with those that are just finding out about this. It's just a shame this has been the mess it has become.

Here's is my official response to all of this.... http://www.2old2play.com/Blog/Recon3k

Do any of you guys have any comprehension how silly this looks as an outsider looking in? I've chuckled to myself 3 or 4 times reading all of these posts. Wow...everyone just chill....

Jeebus, I go away for a little while and we get kicked out of 2o2p, that sucks. :( @Noopy: have another beer, the confusion will fade.

This sucks...I've been a 2old4Duty member for almost a year and have loved every part of it including playing with all the members of the other clans here at 2old2play and especially the LAN this weekend. But I have to say that my allegiance belongs to Stang, Payback, and SHO_NUFF (ECHO). I don't know all the details but I thought this was a clan for "older" gamers. Seems like middle school to me.

I just found out about this yesterday & have to say I am pretty disappointed as a proud member of 2O4D & 2old2play. This site & my 204D peeps have made my xbox gaming fun again... lets keep it that way ;-)

Plato here is the problem. First of all nobody should feel threatened their was no stealing of anyone elses copywrites and anyone has a right to copywrite at any time. I will say that the site is ultimately owned by the admin and they reserve the right to do as they deem fit. What I am disagreeing is that they didnt need to punish the whole 100-200-300+ people in the clan becasue they didnt like the motives of a couple of guys. What it tells me in effect that they are listening to rumors, have a cliche that they will be open with as far as communication and arent open to actively communicating with these bad members before shutting down the lively hood of hundreds of people. Why do you think 2o4d.com will take anything away from 2o2p.com? It is ONLY for the clan members and was put up when 2o2p was down. When 2o2p.com was back up everyone returned and the site was dead. Now we have two sites to cruise on which is even cooler thanks for that guys but still I would rather post here.

Oh and BTW thank you for letting us have an open discussion Admins!!

While I agree that people are free to come and go as they choose, and start up whatever websites they choose, I am pissed off for doodi and the boys that they copyrighted the name...thats BS. I will join their site and inundate it with posts and blogs about whether or not kilts are skirts, or skirts are kilts, or how I might be gay, and whether the fact they I wear socks with sandals is nature or nurture...

If Any 2o4D members need help finding the new clan forum just PM me

JHall55, Wouldn't that be the most childish thing you could do? Seriously, I doubt you'd like to loose that much respect from many people after pulling a stunt like that.

BULL SHIT!@! What the fawk! Who cares if 2o4d had a website???!?!?!? That site has been up since the beginning but the clannies all said we would stick to 2o2p. We even had Tshirts made up and those guys went out of their way to make cool logos. So whats this BS about a competetive site? Lets say for instance that you wanted to start a site about video games.....does this mean your not allowed here at 2o2p????? I own 4 websites am I not allowed her eanymore? THIS IS A BAD CALL....BAD CALL!! YOU ARE SEPERATING THE PLAYERS HERE DONT YOU SEE THAT. NOBODY WAS ANTI 2o2P BUT I GET THE FEELiNG THIS GESTAPO BULlSHIT IS Not IN MY BEST INTEREST. BRING BACK 2o4D!!! I CANT BELIEVE YOU GUYS ACTED LIKE TIMMYS

if they wanted to started another site i have no problem with that, but yanking something off 2o2p and copy writing it, is like a slap in the face. i dont think ds or doodi should have any tolerance to that. to me its pretty much like identity theft. shady

OK I have a serious question here Since one of the big objections is the claim that the name 2Old4Duty is IP of 2old2play and that applying for copyright is some how stabing them in the back I would like to know who exaclty is claiming that this name is their IP and for what reason. I would also like them to demostrate evidence of the use of this name by any of the admins of 2old2play on this site prior to Jan 30th 2007 Before the trolls start flaming you cannot claim IP on formating so arguing that it starts with 2old will not stand up legally.

Shit happens. Looks like I'll be a member of two sites now. And two is bigger than one. I learnt that in kindygarden!

Whoa...

http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/ How do I copyright a name, title, slogan or logo? Copyright does not protect names, titles, slogans, or short phrases. In some cases, these things may be protected as trademarks. Contact the U.S. Patent & Trademark Office, 800-786-9199, for further information. However, copyright protection may be available for logo artwork that contains sufficient authorship. In some circumstances, an artistic logo may also be protected as a trademark. http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/tmfaq.htm What is a trademark? A trademark includes any word, name, symbol, or device, or any combination, used, or intended to be used, in commerce to identify and distinguish the goods of one manufacturer or seller from goods manufactured or sold by others, and to indicate the source of the goods. In short, a trademark is a brand name. As a member of 2old4Forzatoo and 2old4Duty, I'm not sure if I'll stay or go or both. Maybe I'll just go back to playing GoW with an informal decent bunch of guys that befriended me when I was a noob.

I agree with D, I really hope all you guys that were at the LAN choose to stick around. Had a blast hanging with you.

Whoa...that's pretty messed up of them to do that. :(

wow

wow, a lot of you 2o4d children seem not to understand copyright. Putting a copyright symbol in a youtube video is pretty all that is required to pursue ownership of the property later. As to the 'kneejerk' reaction you whine about. Listen, fuckwads, why don't you create something, put it into a public place and let 10k+ other people have access to it, and then, when a small group of people take your branding and try to copyright the idea, see if you don't suddenly feel threatened that if you don't enforce it immediately that you know you stand a good chance of losing the ownership of that IP. Didn't realise that did you? Well, maybe before you start weeping from your mangina and trying to defend people (OLs of 2o4d) that are in the wrong, maybe you'd like to educate yourself first. You see, in the case of the admins here, it's a dangerous game to be calm about something like a copyright that they'd never heard of before. Sure, it could be nothing, hopefully is nothing. Lots of people toss the copyright symbol after things in jest. But in the event that it wasn't in jest, it's best to react EXACTLY the way Doodi and DS did. What they did is completely appropriate, and if you don't understand that, then you're not nearly as mature and adult as you think. Because at the end of the day, people suck and it's best to protect what you've created from what you hope and pray is a nonexistent threat. But from the reaction from the OL's of 2o4d, it's either that they're stupid or complicit in the application of that copyright. Copyrights, they're serious business.

"You understand that[b] all content produced by members or posters not employed directly by 2old2play is the property of that poster[/b] and 2old2play cannot be held liable for such content. http://www.2old2play.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=26079&...

I'd hate to see you guys leave. I'm a quasi-member of 2o4d, and really enjoyed playing with y'all, but my allegiance is to Profanity.

DRAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just want to say I am totally hurt and upset by what happened here. I never thought in my entire time working on 2old2play that one of our own mods would do something like this. Not once was I ever informed of this move which only shows that the plans were kept secret for becuase those involved knew it was wrong. It is a shame they choose to keep a name that we freely give to so many clans on 2old2play. I still have not had a chance to speak with some members, but as D said we are friendly with so many of you. Im shocked, upset, let down, and sick to my stomach. It is quite possibly the biggest let down since starting 2old2play years ago. I never thought anyone would try to steal what we all built here. I guess I was wrong. As always, feel free to PM me. Im here, recovering from the LAN. PEACE

Damn this sucks, one of the best things about 2o2p is community and for this to happen is a serious blow to the site.