I'm just hoping there will be better deals than in the past.
So am I. I know games on demand have been unreasonably high priced. I've always attributed that to MS not wanting to under cut their main retail partners.
Have we read anything on check-in for digital downloaded games? My brain is fuzzy atm and I can't see why you couldn't play that type offline indefinitely.
Have we read anything on check-in for digital downloaded games? My brain is fuzzy atm and I can't see why you couldn't play that type offline indefinitely.
Nah, problem is it checks for any discs, always. It's discs that are the problem. If there was no bluray drive and everything was downloaded, we wouldn't have this problem. It's annoying that we have to deal with this but next gen will be 100% digital. This is just the transition phase.
I was getting super upset about all this whining, but I got online last night and talked shit about everyone behind their backs and I feel much much better now...all kidding aside I actually got to give the community kudos for being so cordial I know there has got to be some massive flame wars out there on other sites but this site is quite cool...I just like that I can insult people and no one ever takes it seriously because they just throw a friendly "fuck you" back.
LOL nothing stirs up the pot like a new console release, and this one has been a doozy, so much to talk shite about. As the last few threads on the subject have not been locked down I guess the initial shit storm has died down and we will settle into a holding pattern until they release.
As long as updates don't brick a console, I'm glad I won't have to suddenly get disconnected from Live to wait while a progress bar installs an update. Just play the game because its already installed.
However, this could affect data caps. You know, you have a ton of games, but aren't using your console. Big updates are pushed and installed while you aren't using the console, eating up bandwidth type thing. I can see why this -could- be an issue.
It would also enforce everyone updating their games so you couldn't avoid a. Update? Damn phone....
I'm assuming you can turn off auto-updates. I figure this because if a bad update gets pushed out and screws up a game, that way people can avoid it.
Updates NOW require you to download them or log off Live, so I fail to see what orifice you pulled your assumption out of?
And if you hear before hand that there's a bad update and avoid it, oops, 24 hrs and you're shut off anyway. Oh, but you can watch tv and such, but oops, now that pesky updates there again...and don't kid yourself, they are all about convienence so I'm doubting you'll get asked, it'll already be done, you know, to make your online experience as pleasant as possible, for your own good..
Well they don't kick you off live forever. If you're checking a game for updates, you've already done your 24 hour check. So it boots you off live. Then, you connect and it checks the game for updates. Which checks you for the 24 hour check already. Then it boots you. It's no different. Any time you're at risk of being booted for not accepting an update, you have already done your check.
However, I see it changing to a "you can't play online multiplayer" unless you update - but not kicking you off Live connection entirely.
Autarch wrote:
As long as updates don't brick a console, I'm glad I won't have to suddenly get disconnected from Live to wait while a progress bar installs an update. Just play the game because its already installed.
However, this could affect data caps. You know, you have a ton of games, but aren't using your console. Big updates are pushed and installed while you aren't using the console, eating up bandwidth type thing. I can see why this -could- be an issue.
Updates are 1-5MB now. Even if that doubles, it's not going to hit anyone's data cap.
It isn't just the size of them Shadow, but the frequency as well. After all, Sunset Overdrive alone mentioned new content they want weekly. So a 10 megabyte update per week on one game, regardless of whether you play it that week. Add more games to the mix. It will have an impact greater than today is all I mean.
P.S. I think Shadow is a haxor! Every time I tried to post a comment in this thread today it took me against my will to his profile!! Now I'm gonna click submit and see what happens....
P.S. I think Shadow is a haxor! Every time I tried to post a comment in this thread today it took me against my will to his profile!! Now I'm gonna click submit and see what happens....
Remember how store-bought on-disc PC games work? Once you install, they require a one time online registration with a code that can only be used once, the disc is not playable...only used for installation.
If you cannot play the game off of the disc (like pc games), and only use it to install.....then no one else can install it and run it because that code would already be registered to console 1, and the xbox could just uninstall the game once it detects that the code is already registered. And if the second console stayed disconnected while trying to install, it would NEVER register, and so would NEVER load the software to a playable state. Keeping people from stealing it.
Register it once online. There is no need for a 24 hour check-in.
There are no codes. It's disc based. This keeps people from using any disc and using a code generating program like it prevalent in PC games.
And because it’s disc based, and because an installation based on that disc is tied to a specific XBL account, how does a subsequent installation get authorization to also run software based on that disc? That would mean that MS would have to authorize installs from the same disc twice, to two separate accounts?
Shadow wrote:
And it's moot anyway because you couldn't force an uninstall on another box that was offline, . . . .
True, but you could force a box to be online to uninstall . . . . . .
Xbox doesn’t connect to the internet like a PC. It connects to an MS network. So why can’t game installs be a matter of license management?
Remember how store-bought on-disc PC games work? Once you install, they require a one time online registration with a code that can only be used once, the disc is not playable...only used for installation.
If you cannot play the game off of the disc (like pc games), and only use it to install.....then no one else can install it and run it because that code would already be registered to console 1, and the xbox could just uninstall the game once it detects that the code is already registered. And if the second console stayed disconnected while trying to install, it would NEVER register, and so would NEVER load the software to a playable state. Keeping people from stealing it.
Register it once online. There is no need for a 24 hour check-in.
There are no codes. It's disc based. This keeps people from using any disc and using a code generating program like it prevalent in PC games.
And because it’s disc based, and because an installation based on that disc is tied to a specific XBL account, how does a subsequent installation get authorization to also run software based on that disc? That would mean that MS would have to authorize installs from the same disc twice, to two separate accounts?
Shadow wrote:
And it's moot anyway because you couldn't force an uninstall on another box that was offline, . . . .
True, but you could force a box to be online to uninstall . . . . . .
Xbox doesn’t connect to the internet like a PC. It connects to an MS network. So why can’t game installs be a matter of license management?
Because I don't know. But it does connect to the internet first - run a NAT check on your 360 and watch it connect to the internet in the flow chart. Also if you tried to sell to Gamestop and they took the license off your account, but you remained offline - you could keep playing that copy indefinitely as long as you didn't connect to the net. Hence the 24 hour check.
Because I don't know. But it does connect to the internet first - run a NAT check on your 360 and watch it connect to the internet in the flow chart. Also if you tried to sell to Gamestop and they took the license off your account, but you remained offline - you could keep playing that copy indefinitely as long as you didn't connect to the net. Hence the 24 hour check.
LOL!! It was really freakin me out! I'd click "submit" and boom! it would say "NO! But you may view Shadow's profile if you like! Muhahaha!" (Okay I added the evil laugh) Happened three times. I was skeered!
And I'm NOT gonna requote all that crap. My point was, plain and simple, that the update was part of the requirement for the "check in" and not applying or accepting the update would require you to log/sign out and you wouldn't get credited with your 24 hr check...all the rest of that stuff you keep repeating we've all seen/read before and it's really getting monotonous, seriously.
And I'm NOT gonna requote all that crap. My point was, plain and simple, that the update was part of the requirement for the "check in" and not applying or accepting the update would require you to log/sign out and you wouldn't get credited with your 24 hr check...all the rest of that stuff you keep repeating we've all seen/read before and it's really getting monotonous, seriously.
I'm saying you're wrong. Your check is XBL based, not game based. Game updates only run once you start a game, and you'd already be connected and checked. It's that simple.
And I'm NOT gonna requote all that crap. My point was, plain and simple, that the update was part of the requirement for the "check in" and not applying or accepting the update would require you to log/sign out and you wouldn't get credited with your 24 hr check...all the rest of that stuff you keep repeating we've all seen/read before and it's really getting monotonous, seriously.
I'm saying you're wrong. Your check is XBL based, not game based. Game updates only run once you start a game, and you'd already be connected and checked. It's that simple.
Says you, but now all games are installed on the HD, no need to start the game to check...prove it.
And I'm NOT gonna requote all that crap. My point was, plain and simple, that the update was part of the requirement for the "check in" and not applying or accepting the update would require you to log/sign out and you wouldn't get credited with your 24 hr check...all the rest of that stuff you keep repeating we've all seen/read before and it's really getting monotonous, seriously.
I'm saying you're wrong. Your check is XBL based, not game based. Game updates only run once you start a game, and you'd already be connected and checked. It's that simple.
Says you, but now all games are installed on the HD, no need to start the game to check...prove it.
Yet, games do only run updates when you run the game - that's part of the game then. They update when not running, but that isn't the same. Checks don't need a game to run I'd think, or when the game is being updated.
. . . . . . words, things and stuff . . . . . please see above . . . . .
Xbox doesn’t connect to the internet like a PC. It connects to an MS network. So why can’t game installs be a matter of license management?
Because I don't know. But it does connect to the internet first - run a NAT check on your 360 and watch it connect to the internet in the flow chart. Also if you tried to sell to Gamestop and they took the license off your account, but you remained offline - you could keep playing that copy indefinitely as long as you didn't connect to the net. Hence the 24 hour check.
It does connect to the internet, but only as a means to connect to MS. It’s not an open part of the internet.
Thinking in terms of a few types of license management systems implemented for other forms of software: Software won’t run if it doesn’t have a license. You have to get online to get a license. Once you have a license, the software runs, online or offline. Get online and give the license back, your software won’t run anymore, and that license is now available for someone else to use. Rinse, repeat.
Buy game disc, which as we discussed is uniquely identifiable in some way, like having an encoded “serial number”. Use disk to install game. At this point, the game will not run. Sign onto XBL. Get license somehow (using authorization codes is popular) from MS. The game will now run, the disc’s “serial number” is now linked with your account, and the game license is now issued to your account. There is no longer a need to be online.
Give disc to a buddy. He uses disk to install game. At this point, he has no license, his game will not run. He signs onto XBL. He is denied a license because the license linked to the disk has already been issued to your account. His game install will not run.
Want to sell? Sign onto to XBL. Return the license to MS. Now your game will not run. Take disc to GS. GS should have some means to verify that the license associated with your disc’s “serial number” has been unassociated with an account. GS should then give you some pittance in exchange for your disc. GS should then have some means to identify that license as available for a new user, tag it for reissuance to a new user and resell it. Rinse, repeat.
Give disc to a buddy. He uses disk to install game. At this point, he has no license, his game will not run. He signs onto XBL. He is denied a license because the license linked to the disk has already been issued to your account. His game install will not run.
So he unregisters the game from you and registers it to him (or to Gamestop).
All of what you wrote is how it works, except this part. This is because you will be able to unregister a game without the other person's box being connected. Because of this, you need to connect that other box within 24 hours in order to retake that license from that installed game. MS can't force you to have your primary box turned on at all times. That is the reason for 24 hour check, to revoke or add licenses that may have happened elsewhere.
Your license may have been revoked on your account, but your box doesn't know that. Hence the connection.
Give disc to a buddy. He uses disk to install game. At this point, he has no license, his game will not run. He signs onto XBL. He is denied a license because the license linked to the disk has already been issued to your account. His game install will not run.
So he unregisters the game from you and registers it to him (or to Gamestop).
All of what you wrote is how it works, except this part. This is because you will be able to unregister a game without the other person's box being connected. Because of this, you need to connect that other box within 24 hours in order to retake that license from that installed game. MS can't force you to have your primary box turned on at all times. That is the reason for 24 hour check, to revoke or add licenses that may have happened elsewhere.
Your license may have been revoked on your account, but your box doesn't know that. Hence the connection.
i could log in under my GT on my console and unregister a game on your xbox registered under your GT? That doesn't make sense to me.
Or do you mean I could log onto two consoles and install on both under my GT, which is fine. Then I'd have two instances of that license, or two valid licenses if you'd prefer. I'd have to turn them both back in to free the license in its entirety. I couldn't free the corresponding install disk by releasing only one.
If you have to buy a license that grants permission for you to play the game and requires you to check in with Microsoft every day then you never truly own the game. I'm hoping for a massive hacker attack on Microsoft servers the day of release. The outrage would be priceless.
Have we read anything on check-in for digital downloaded games? My brain is fuzzy atm and I can't see why you couldn't play that type offline indefinitely.
Nah, problem is it checks for any discs, always. It's discs that are the problem. If there was no bluray drive and everything was downloaded, we wouldn't have this problem. It's annoying that we have to deal with this but next gen will be 100% digital. This is just the transition phase.
word gatsu. word Deep.
I was getting super upset about all this whining, but I got online last night and talked shit about everyone behind their backs and I feel much much better now...all kidding aside I actually got to give the community kudos for being so cordial I know there has got to be some massive flame wars out there on other sites but this site is quite cool...I just like that I can insult people and no one ever takes it seriously because they just throw a friendly "fuck you" back.
LOL nothing stirs up the pot like a new console release, and this one has been a doozy, so much to talk shite about. As the last few threads on the subject have not been locked down I guess the initial shit storm has died down and we will settle into a holding pattern until they release.
Your right there Oldschool, been caught out by that one just before a race a couple of times. That is a fact of life on consoles.
As long as updates don't brick a console, I'm glad I won't have to suddenly get disconnected from Live to wait while a progress bar installs an update. Just play the game because its already installed.
However, this could affect data caps. You know, you have a ton of games, but aren't using your console. Big updates are pushed and installed while you aren't using the console, eating up bandwidth type thing. I can see why this -could- be an issue.
Well they don't kick you off live forever. If you're checking a game for updates, you've already done your 24 hour check. So it boots you off live. Then, you connect and it checks the game for updates. Which checks you for the 24 hour check already. Then it boots you. It's no different. Any time you're at risk of being booted for not accepting an update, you have already done your check.
However, I see it changing to a "you can't play online multiplayer" unless you update - but not kicking you off Live connection entirely.
Updates are 1-5MB now. Even if that doubles, it's not going to hit anyone's data cap.
It isn't just the size of them Shadow, but the frequency as well. After all, Sunset Overdrive alone mentioned new content they want weekly. So a 10 megabyte update per week on one game, regardless of whether you play it that week. Add more games to the mix. It will have an impact greater than today is all I mean.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvTLuek9ung&feature=player_detailpage#t=2s
That was epic!
LMAO
P.S. I think Shadow is a haxor! Every time I tried to post a comment in this thread today it took me against my will to his profile!! Now I'm gonna click submit and see what happens....
Did you just submit to Shadow?
(all your words)
Whaaaaaaa?
And because it’s disc based, and because an installation based on that disc is tied to a specific XBL account, how does a subsequent installation get authorization to also run software based on that disc? That would mean that MS would have to authorize installs from the same disc twice, to two separate accounts?
True, but you could force a box to be online to uninstall . . . . . .
Xbox doesn’t connect to the internet like a PC. It connects to an MS network. So why can’t game installs be a matter of license management?
Because I don't know. But it does connect to the internet first - run a NAT check on your 360 and watch it connect to the internet in the flow chart. Also if you tried to sell to Gamestop and they took the license off your account, but you remained offline - you could keep playing that copy indefinitely as long as you didn't connect to the net. Hence the 24 hour check.
LOL!! It was really freakin me out! I'd click "submit" and boom! it would say "NO! But you may view Shadow's profile if you like! Muhahaha!" (Okay I added the evil laugh) Happened three times. I was skeered!
Shadow,
And I'm NOT gonna requote all that crap. My point was, plain and simple, that the update was part of the requirement for the "check in" and not applying or accepting the update would require you to log/sign out and you wouldn't get credited with your 24 hr check...all the rest of that stuff you keep repeating we've all seen/read before and it's really getting monotonous, seriously.
I'm saying you're wrong. Your check is XBL based, not game based. Game updates only run once you start a game, and you'd already be connected and checked. It's that simple.
Says you, but now all games are installed on the HD, no need to start the game to check...prove it.
Yet, games do only run updates when you run the game - that's part of the game then. They update when not running, but that isn't the same. Checks don't need a game to run I'd think, or when the game is being updated.
Who knows :)
Exactly.
And I'm tired of wandering around wondering...
Never thought about the "DRM Legal Issues" over here.
Sweet.gif "6")
I
It does connect to the internet, but only as a means to connect to MS. It’s not an open part of the internet.
Thinking in terms of a few types of license management systems implemented for other forms of software: Software won’t run if it doesn’t have a license. You have to get online to get a license. Once you have a license, the software runs, online or offline. Get online and give the license back, your software won’t run anymore, and that license is now available for someone else to use. Rinse, repeat.
Buy game disc, which as we discussed is uniquely identifiable in some way, like having an encoded “serial number”. Use disk to install game. At this point, the game will not run. Sign onto XBL. Get license somehow (using authorization codes is popular) from MS. The game will now run, the disc’s “serial number” is now linked with your account, and the game license is now issued to your account. There is no longer a need to be online.
Give disc to a buddy. He uses disk to install game. At this point, he has no license, his game will not run. He signs onto XBL. He is denied a license because the license linked to the disk has already been issued to your account. His game install will not run.
Want to sell? Sign onto to XBL. Return the license to MS. Now your game will not run. Take disc to GS. GS should have some means to verify that the license associated with your disc’s “serial number” has been unassociated with an account. GS should then give you some pittance in exchange for your disc. GS should then have some means to identify that license as available for a new user, tag it for reissuance to a new user and resell it. Rinse, repeat.
So he unregisters the game from you and registers it to him (or to Gamestop).
All of what you wrote is how it works, except this part. This is because you will be able to unregister a game without the other person's box being connected. Because of this, you need to connect that other box within 24 hours in order to retake that license from that installed game. MS can't force you to have your primary box turned on at all times. That is the reason for 24 hour check, to revoke or add licenses that may have happened elsewhere.
Your license may have been revoked on your account, but your box doesn't know that. Hence the connection.
i could log in under my GT on my console and unregister a game on your xbox registered under your GT? That doesn't make sense to me.
Or do you mean I could log onto two consoles and install on both under my GT, which is fine. Then I'd have two instances of that license, or two valid licenses if you'd prefer. I'd have to turn them both back in to free the license in its entirety. I couldn't free the corresponding install disk by releasing only one.